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SG files and new editing tools
(07-14-2021, 07:26 PM)Tjerk Wrote: Providing the above bugs can be resolved: do you guys consider it possible for this new tool to actually increase the drawing distance in-game or would that be hardcoded into the game itself?
We still don't know, by what the drawing distance is defined. Maybe it's hardcoded in the game, but the DATA section in the 3D file is still a mystery.
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(07-14-2021, 08:52 PM)Dennis Wrote:
(07-14-2021, 07:26 PM)Tjerk Wrote: Providing the above bugs can be resolved: do you guys consider it possible for this new tool to actually increase the drawing distance in-game or would that be hardcoded into the game itself?
We still don't know, by what the drawing distance is defined. Maybe it's hardcoded in the game, but the DATA section in the 3D file is still a mystery.

I think the game draws a certain number of sections ahead and behind you, let's say +/-10. I once divided up a track into tiny sections and noticed that the "draw distance" seemed greatly reduced.

But which particular sections get drawn when you are somewhere along the track, I want to say it has to do with DATA since those appear to be DLONG references. I guess theoretically you can link more track sections to each of the LISTs that are related to the DATA entries, but that's just a guess.
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(07-15-2021, 08:26 AM)checkpoint10 Wrote:
(07-14-2021, 08:52 PM)Dennis Wrote:
(07-14-2021, 07:26 PM)Tjerk Wrote: Providing the above bugs can be resolved: do you guys consider it possible for this new tool to actually increase the drawing distance in-game or would that be hardcoded into the game itself?
We still don't know, by what the drawing distance is defined. Maybe it's hardcoded in the game, but the DATA section in the 3D file is still a mystery.

I think the game draws a certain number of sections ahead and behind you, let's say +/-10. I once divided up a track into tiny sections and noticed that the "draw distance" seemed greatly reduced.

But which particular sections get drawn when you are somewhere along the track, I want to say it has to do with DATA since those appear to be DLONG references. I guess theoretically you can link more track sections to each of the LISTs that are related to the DATA entries, but that's just a guess.

Yes that's probably right, because GP3 converted tracks usually have a lot of sections and especially in corners you can feel like you're driving into the void sometimes. Anyway I am just pondering for a bit, for now let's hope that Boblogsan will be able to fix the drawing order in his tool so you can start using it as a one to one replacement.
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I have been testing multiple versions of Boblogsan's tool and happy to report that the version 0.1.2rc1 now appears to correctly convert a track from N3 to ICR2. This particular version is here: https://github.com/nooRok/icr2_3dto3do/r.../v0.1.2rc1

I will continue to use this tool and see if I encounter any further issues. But it is very promising so far. I would encourage anyone with a track in progress to try it now.
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(07-17-2021, 04:25 PM)checkpoint10 Wrote: I have been testing multiple versions of Boblogsan's tool and happy to report that the version 0.1.2rc1 now appears to correctly convert a track from N3 to ICR2. This particular version is here: https://github.com/nooRok/icr2_3dto3do/r.../v0.1.2rc1

I will continue to use this tool and see if I encounter any further issues. But it is very promising so far. I would encourage anyone with a track in progress to try it now.

Another new version of the 3d23do.py tool by nooRok (Boblogsan): Release 0.1.2rc2 · nooRok/icr2_3dto3do · GitHub

I have tested this on Detroit and it works well. It also works for Nashville but the issue with cars being drawn through elevation changes is still there - but at least it leaves us in the same place as where we were with the N2toICR2 process.
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(07-18-2021, 05:52 PM)checkpoint10 Wrote: ...... the issue with cars being drawn through elevation changes is still there - .......

I don't know if this will make any of you disagree with me but the fact that the cars can be "seen through a hill" does not bother me.  I think it's because to me, track editing is and will always be somewhat magical- because I see it through my eyes "as a kid".  All of the tracks that I have (not the papy tracks) have this problem and I guess I am just used to it.  Funny thing is even grand prix 2 has this on some of the original microprose tracks in certain places!

A starving person is thankful when they are given food, even know it may not be food that particularly 'tastes good'

Don't get me wrong- the fact that you search for 'perfection' says a lot about the drive and dedication, which is very impressive. If we did not have motivation like that we could not get anywhere.

I am super thankful that we have the ability that we can now do what we all know is possible with track editing.  The fact that I am able to blast through the tunnel in downtown detroit is enough to make me super happy!!!  Guitarist
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I should clarify that I think that nooRok’s tool does what it does extremely well and I'm really grateful for it. I pointed out the elevation thing mainly because the new tool eliminates the N3 to ICR2 conversion itself as the reason for that bug. And that's good because I think the solution will be found in how each track section in the .3D file is organized (i.e. how are the LIST and BSP functions ordered, maybe how the normal vectors are defined).

I know I keep pointing out the bug but it is the only big mystery remaining just to get this part of a modded track to the same level as the default ones. And for those folks who are getting into ICR2 just recently or more used to other sims, solving it will help raise the immersion.

I will add that, I think this issue will not matter so much for Detroit. But it would be "nice to have" for the more natural terrain road courses and also for the bridge at Nashville.
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Finally had chance to test nooRok's converter. Tried it on simple objects and it works well! Smiley

I will be good if nooRok's can explain what feature he implemented in his tool. What is flavors optimization? What is done with similar vertices? Because N3 3d23do optimizes 3do file, but N99(2) to ICR2 converter expand 3do file.

Also he has number of other tools (python scripts) for Blender, as I understand. One of them is to import and export objects. And base on this tool 3d to 3do converter is made.
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(07-27-2021, 10:26 PM)Pavel 69 Wrote: Finally had chance to test nooRok's converter. Tried it on simple objects and it works well! Smiley

I will be good if nooRok's can explain what feature he implemented in his tool. What is flavors optimization? What is done with similar vertices? Because N3 3d23do optimizes 3do file, but N99(2) to ICR2 converter expand 3do file.

Also he has number of other tools (python scripts) for Blender, as I understand. One of them is to import and export objects. And base on this tool 3d to 3do converter is made.

Yes, the latest version on nooRok's github works well for both objects and the full track.3d file which is great.

nooRok said that flavors optimization slows down the process but it reduces file size, but I don't really know what exactly it does. At least it's open source so we can see what it does.

Is Blender easy to learn, at least enough for the simple ICR2 objects? I once tried Blender for about 10 minutes and gave up due to the learning curve. Currently I am okay with coding by hand, with some help from a Google Sheet that I've made.
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(07-19-2021, 04:14 AM)checkpoint10 Wrote: I should clarify that I think that nooRok’s tool does what it does extremely well and I'm really grateful for it. I pointed out the elevation thing mainly because the new tool eliminates the N3 to ICR2 conversion itself as the reason for that bug. And that's good because I think the solution will be found in how each track section in the .3D file is organized (i.e. how are the LIST and BSP functions ordered, maybe how the normal vectors are defined).

I know I keep pointing out the bug but it is the only big mystery remaining just to get this part of a modded track to the same level as the default ones. And for those folks who are getting into ICR2 just recently or more used to other sims, solving it will help raise the immersion.

I will add that, I think this issue will not matter so much for Detroit. But it would be "nice to have" for the more natural terrain road courses and also for the bridge at Nashville.
Fixing the track show-through bug would be awesome. I know it's not easy, & may not even be possible, but if it is you guys will work it out. 
We are all so appreciate of the skills & dedication of our track builders. 

Thanks, as always
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